Episode 484 – Shelley Hill talks about The Mingle

Paul: Welcome中国体彩官方app to the polite society podcast powered by the Firearms Policy Coalition recorded on Wednesday, February 20th, 2019, I’m Paul Lathrop.

John: I’m John Richardson, and we’ll talk about the failure of background checks in Illinois.

Belle: I’m Belle McCormack, and we’ll be talking to Shelley Hill about the Women’s Mingle.

Gary: I’m Gary Daugherty and in one of our DGUs don’t bring pepper spray and a BB gun to a gunfight .. so climb aboard

Belle: strap in

John : and hang on!

Paul:  episode 484 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.

Show intro music.

Personal news from each participant (when you are done with your segment please ask the next person what has been up with them)

John – As I said on the last show, I’m cleaning up an older Mossberg 500. I’ve got it cleaned now and the bore just shines. I ordered a Wolff extra power spring and a S&J Hardware delrin follower. I plan to repaint it in some variety of tiger stripe just because I can. In other news, if anyone is into archery, Walmart is closing out a lot of their broadheads and other hunting stuff. I picked up some good deals this weekend. Finally, we celebrated my granddaughter Olivia’s 4th birthday this weekend. It seems like only yesterday that I was holding her as a newborn.


Belle – went on a little vacation from the snow here in Washington, went to AZ. Shot an IDPA match at the Pima pistol club and went a hell of a tourist run – Casa Grande Ruins, Kirchner Caves, Desert Botanical Garden light show, blues concert – some long needed fun and time off. Back to teaching this weekend – Retention.

Grant – well this week has brought some wonderful personal news, the Gallagher family welcomed its newest member, Mariana Nicole Gallagher who was born at 08.41 on February 14th and weighed in at 7 1/2 pounds. She already has wavy black hair. On the shooting front I missed my usual Thursday night range night because of the new arrival, and on Saturday I taught our Florida/Arizona out-of-state permit class. So, all pretty quiet. Paul and Susan?


Promo about upcoming training classes here.

Grant – I’d like to mention that National Train a Teacher day is coming on July 20th. You can join the Facebook page, here:     If you’re a teacher (and that includes kindergarten, K1-12, college or university) or you work at a school or college/university in any capacity (administrator, custodian etc), or a girl or boy scout leader, if you are part of a club or congregation, then join this facebook group to reach out to your local firearms and stop-the-bleed trainers to see what they are offering on that day. Any trainer attached to this group will provide your training free.  Also, you can reach out to Grant personally on NTATD-at-scotshot.com for help locating a class. Finally, you can see all the ScotShot training at the website, or by emailing me at : grant-at-scotshot-dot-com. We’re posting our NRA and USCCA Instructor classes this weekend.

Belle- March 16th and 17th Frank DeYoung from Threat Anatomy coming to teach

Energency Treatment of Gunshot Trauma    and

Shot Placement

Call the office T-F, 9-4 360-978-6100 or got to our website

Gary? What’s going on with you?

Ask listeners to listen to other shows on the network, name at least 2 shows.


2- News

POLITE SOCIETY NEWS, February 20th 2019

Hi everyone. Please remember to send your comments on the news to “onair@”




The story is familiar – someone kills a number of people and after investigation, it turns out that he wasn’t allowed to have his gun. Also, the scene of the murders was a self-declared gun-free zone.

In this case, a man who had held a job for 15 years began shooting in the meeting where he was being fired. In the end, he murdered five people and injured five responding police officers, before he was shot and killed.

Subsequent investigation showed that the murderer obtained his Illinois FOID card in January 2014, and bought his handgun the following March. He passed the background check for his FOID card, but importantly, this background check did not include fingerprinting, according to the town’s police chief, Kristen Ziman.

Shortly after buying his handgun, the murderer applied for an IL concealed carry permit where he *was* fingerprinted. The fingerprint check showed that he had been convicted of felony aggravated assault in 1995 and so, he should never have been able to buy a firearm.

At this time, his concealed carry permit was denied and his FOID card was revoked. He was sent a letter telling him to surrender his handgun at his local police department. Police are currently investigating whether anyone ever followed up on the letter.

It turns out that the murderer had been arrested six times by his local police department, including arrests for domestic violence related issues and violating protection orders – this was in 2008. He was last arrested in 2017 for disorderly conduct and criminal property damage.

So once again we see several potential failures in process that culminated in a multiple murder with the corresponding tragedies. We wonder how the anti-gunners are going to spin this.

Paul – This is a prime example of more laws that just don’t

Gary –

John – It should be noted that he FOID database is run through the NICS system daily!

Gary –

Grant – I’m surprised that FPs aren’t required for a ccw.. and it’s important to remember that each new gun law is described as a “good first step”. Always described as if there are no gun laws at all and no one ever tells you what the first step is leading to.

6 minutes in






A Sheriff in Martin County, Kentucky has warned his local residents to “lock your doors, load your guns and get a barking, biting dog. If the Sheriff’s office can’t protect you, who will?”

One answer to this is the often-heard “you are your own first responder”, which is true, but what would provoke such a comment?

Martin County is a small, rural community of around 13,000 people. The Sheriff’s office operates with two paid officers and several volunteers. He was expecting money to be released for him, but it didn’t happen and he was forced to cut the volunteers it seems – he said “I can’t expect people not work if I can’t pay them.” It’s hard to tell if this is simply a statement of bald truth, or a high-stakes game of chicken. There is no police coverage in his area so his two-man team is everything.

Sheriff Kirk told a recent meeting of his local fiscal court that his agency was owed $75,000 from the court, so he temporarily suspended law enforcement services. Underpinning this financial crisis is a lowering of revenues from a settlement resulting from the decline in the coal industry.

Rural counties all over the country中国体彩官方app are facing their own versions of this and often, their sheriff’s department operate on small budgets with low manpower. Sheriff Kirk is one of the few who has openly said that the consequence is that individuals need to step up and take personal responsibility. He noted that policing services are secondary to the role of sheriff in collecting taxes, serving papers and perform bailiff services.

Sheriff’s Departments appear to be stepping up to problems affecting the communities they serve, including those related to the push for gun control in urban liberal communities. For example, 10 county sheriffs in Washington State have come out saying they will not enforce the 1639 laws and 29 county sheriffs in New Mexico are opposing multiple gun control initiatives in that state.

10 minutes in





KILLED with predjudice







Nevada Democrat Governor Steve Sisolak just signed a universal background check bill. The bill will prevent the private sales of long guns between friends or family members.

Governor Sisolak quotes the same tired agenda statements such as, this is long overdue and common sense, it will make Nevada safer and will save lives, that guns represent a public health crisis and that it would make it harder for dangerous individuals to access a firearm.

There is a sense of inevitability about the gradual state-by-state placement of these laws, but one thing that is particularly interesting lies in 4473 form.

Question 32 says “check if this transaction is a private party transfer.” The instructions for this question state: “check this box or write ‘private party transfer’ in question 31 if the licensee – that is, the FFL – is facilitating the sale or transfer of a firearm between private unlicensed individuals in according with ATF procedure 2013-1.” At the moment in many states this is voluntary, but it is interesting that the 4473 is “universal ready”, and has been so since 2013.

John – I didn’t realize that the 4473 had changed. Since I was just in NV, what kind of shocked me was the billboards and marijuana stores everywhere.




Paul -STORY SIX – Not going to get to this – roger that!   


This week, the House Judiciary Committee voted 23-15 – along party lines – to advance Democrat-proposed universal background check legislation to the House floor. This legislation would require background checks for virtually all firearms sales and transfers.

However, they rejected a potentially important amendment from Republican Representative Greg Steube of Florida. Steube’s Amendment would have required that law enforcement be alerted if a person were to fail the NICS check. The democrat committee declined to incorporate this.

Steube said later that “…the fact that Democrats do not want law enforcement notified if an individual attempting to purchase a firearm fails a background check is truly troubling.”

He continued: “In rejecting this amendment, the Democrats have shown their true colors. It is clear they are not interested in preventing gun violence or stopping the illegal purchase of firearms, but rather they are only interested in limiting the rights of law-abiding citizens to advance their own political agenda.”

In separate amendments, the GOP tried to include language that would alert I.C.E. if illegal aliens attempted to buy guns – the Democrat majority committee also rejected this. A separate amendment that would allow exceptions in the case of transfer of  firearms to family members at risk of domestic violence, was also rejected.

Representative Matt Gaetz said after the vote that “Democrats hate ICE so much, they would prefer to keep ICE from knowing when illegals try to get guns.”

Democrat committee chair Jerry Nadler closed the debate after 10 hours even though there were additional Republican amendments to be heard.

It is not known when the House will take the Bill for a vote, but it should be noted that if passed into law, it would not have prevented any of the recent mass murders.




Gun Quotes



Hang on everybody, we’ll be back with our guest (Name).


3- Interview 1

4- Interview 2

5- DGUs  (at beginning) These discussions are NOT legal advice. Some of us are trainers, but this is not formal training and YOU NEED formal training. The Defensive Gun Use segment is intended as information, NOT as training. As always the opinions of the hosts are only their own opinions and not those of any sponsors or other affiliations.

Belle – Federal Way, Washington
Casandra Cooksey heard a car door slam outside her 中国体彩官方app just before midnight.  She was 中国体彩官方app alone with her infant daughter. She started to panic. She grabbed her firearm and went peeking around a corner.  That was when she saw a man in the opening in the door.
The man appeared to be intoxicated and refused to leave.  He started to get agitated when he was told to go away.
Cooksey called her husband at work and then called her neighbor, Daniel Wilson.  Wilson ran outside. He was also armed.
“I said you ain’t going nowhere bud, leave the house alone,” he said.
A few minutes later police arrived and took the man into custody.  They determined that no crime had taken place and eventually dropped the man off at 中国体彩官方app with his wife in Tacoma.
Cooksey said she was glad to be prepared.
“That’s the last thing I wanted to do, but first thing that went through my mind when I heard the door being tried to be open – I just wanted to protect myself and my baby,” Cooksey said. “There’s no doubt in my mind I would have pulled the trigger to protect myself and her if he got in the house.”

Paul  – unauthorised occupation of a premisies is
Grant – don’t get between momma bear and baby bear

John – Kingsport, Tennessee
An armed man went to a Kingsport dentist office and shot and killed his wife.  At the same time, a concealed carry permit holder was there, armed, and he reacted to the shooting.  He shot the gunman and kept him detained until law enforcement arrived.
The wife was an employee of the dentist office. The two have not been identified and a motive was unknown.  The gunman was taken to the hospital with “a couple of gunshot wounds.”
“It’s a citizen, a concealed-carry permit holder, that saw a threat, eliminated that threat and stood by until law enforcement arrived – he did a really good job,” Sullivan County Sheriff Jeff Cassidy said.
No one else was injured at the time of the shooting.

Paul – a good example why you need training

Grant – this is a great example of how everyday people step up and define the outcome of a critical threat

Grant – Allentown, Pennsylvania
Antonio Santiago had just gotten off work and had parked his car on Turner Street in Allentown on Saturday.  He was headed to visit with a friend when he was set upon by two masked men.

They sprayed him with pepper spray, hit him with a gun and demanded his money.
The 36 year old man told them to hold on while he looked for his money.  Instead of his money, he grabbed his handgun and fired one shot at the two thugs.

The bullet hit one of the two.  He fled but fell about 50 feet away.  He expired where he lay.

In a statement Monday, Lehigh County District Attorney James Martin said Santiago, who had a carry permit, was justified in using deadly force in the encounter.

According to a police statement, they found the second thug administering CPR to his compatriot.  Nearby a female was screaming about her boyfriend being dead.

Police found a BB gun in a nearby trash can; investigation revealed that the three had planned the attempted robbery and the BB gun and pepper spray belonged to the female.

After her boyfriend was shot, the female suspect recovered the BB gun and discarded it in the trash can. Both were charged with robbery and criminal conspiracy to commit robbery.  She was also charged with tampering with evidence.


Paul – in man

11 minutes in

Paul Lavaca, Arkansas
It is good to have friends and family nearby to watch your 中国体彩官方app and belongings when you are away.  A Lavaca 中国体彩官方appowner’s brother and a mutual friend spotted two men removing items from their 中国体彩官方app. The two of them caught the men as they were stacking the items alongside the road as though they were waiting for a ride. They also saw a white car drive by with a female driver, and the friend was able to get a picture of the car.
The friend was holding a rifle when they confronted the burglars and they held them until police arrived.
During a search of the men, deputies found 2 driver’s licenses in a wallet and a third in the yard.  They found three cameras and a laptop in a backpack.
The two were also found to have warrants issued against them.  They were placed under arrest and taken to the county detention center.  Along the way, the deputy drove by one of the men’s addresses and spotted a car matching the photo.  That suspect admitted that the car belonged to him and his wife.
The two were charged with numerous crimes.

14 minutes in

Gary – Arcata, California
Zoraida and Jim Oullette own and live in a 中国体彩官方app in Arcata.  At 12:30 AM, Jim looked out the window and saw someone on their knees screaming at the end of the court.  He went to a neighbor’s truck and started shaking it, then moved to the Oullette’s and started banging on it.  He then made his way to their front door and started banging on it.
He was yelling for them to open the door.  They yelled at him to go away and Jim retrieved his gun from the bedroom.
Zoraida had called police when the man kicked the door down.
“You could see the door buckling, then everything, the wood and everything just flew out,” Jim said.  “He just stood there and so I just held my gun and waited for the police to get there.”
The invader was arrested and taken to the hospital to be treated for hypothermia.  Due to prior convictions, he was taken to jail after treatment.

We post each of our news and defensive gun use articles at Polite Society Podcast.com  Please take a minute and share them with a friend.


6- E-mail, blog notes, and show close

Listener e-mail discussion

Paul: Rob, do you have any new posts you want to mention?

Grant – I will read for Rob

Rob- In one article I said, David Hogg was a student at Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School in Parkland, Florida. He has ridden to notoriety on that affiliation.. and on Michael Bloomberg’s money. Recently, for turning the Parkland murderer into a celebrity. Hogg is wrong about gun control, but he is right about the news media.

In another article I said, This will be our epitaph if the US fails as a country中国体彩官方app;

“We wanted to stop doing stupid things.. but we were addicted to money and power.”

Our list of our stupid government actions is endless, but the regulation of firearms mufflers has to be near the top of the list. I didn’t believe it until I heard it with my own ears. We should be shouting for muffler deregulation.

That and more are up at , at and at my blog,  John, tell us what’s new at your blog no lawyers only guns and money.

The would-be gun banners in North Carolina have introduced what they are calling the Gun Violence Prevention Act. None of the 14 provisions in the bill do anything to prevent the criminal misuse of firearms. However, there are things in the bill that would seek to destroy gun ownership in North Carolina. Things like the adoption of the California handgun roster, mandatory firearms liability insurance for all gun owners, and elimination of state preemption among other things. It should be noted that one of the primary sponsors of the bill is the former NC Chapter Head for the Demanding Moms who got elected this past November. I call this bill I am working on a follow-up post profiling the 4 Democrats who have sponsored the bill.

That and more is at

Paul: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast.  I’d like to thank (Guests) for joining us today. So for Amy, Tracy, Belle, Dana, Douglas, Gary, John, Rachel, Susan, Grant and Rob,

(Paul, stop talking now)

Grant: Until the next time…

Gary: stay safe,

Belle: be aware,

John: and we’ll see you down the road.